Fruits price? rice? B12? sugar? veggies?

[RRM]

Is there tests for check your insulin response? This would be the perfect answer for to know how much fruits/fish one can eat at once?

It would not give you any answers other than what was the response to that specific meal given those specific circumstances, which constantly change.
There is a very effective method though: listening to your body.

Because me, i can't really say when my body needs or not sugar. I just feel hungry and want to eat few fruits together. And if i listen my body and my needs, i would directly go the Mac Donalds.

Ok, so you can distinguish between black and white. No its time to learn about that gray-area. You just need to learn to notice when you start feeling a tiny bit of hungry, and respond to it with a small meal.
Simply try to notice the big hunger vefore its actually there. the more often you try, the better you will get at it. Eventually, you will be able to notice the slightest bit of hunger.

Is it possible to check this?

Unfortunately, no.
I believe there are ways to check your blood sugar (for diabetes patients)

the body must cleave the longer chains of sugar, one by one
...
Which is true?

Both. Though it is not true that the glucose molecules are cleaved from long sugars only one by one. These enzymes are like sentinels in the matrix; they are everywhere cutting off pieces.
One molecule of starch holds waaaay much more energy than one molecule of sucrose

When someone tells me "a moderate serving of pastas is good because the speed at which they enter the blood as glucose is slower"

Its true, the first glucose from fruits enters the blood much faster than the first glucose from starch, but that is not what the spike causes. The spike is caused when multiple glucose enters the bloodstream at the same time.
With fruits, you immediately feel the energy, and the glucose entering the bloodstream inhibits your hunger, so that you never ingest huge amounts of glucose.
With pasta etc, it takes a while before there is such a feedback mechanism, so that your hunger is only inhibited by the extend that your stomach has been filled up. But by that time there is already a huge amount of glucose (starch) in your stomach, and they will enter the bloodstream in large numbers.

So, a moderate serving of pasta supplies you with way more energy than a moderate serving of fruit, giving way to a greater spike in insulin.
With pasta it takes more time for the energy 'to kick in', but once it kicks in, it kicks in big time.

[Rivera]

Is there tests for check your insulin response? This would be the perfect answer for to know how much fruits/fish one can eat at once?

It would not give you any answers other than what was the response to that specific meal given those specific circumstances, which constantly change.

But my snacks do not change usually. That's why I want to check. Especially my breakfast, which contains munchfood (white bread, chocolate etc...)

Is it possible to check this?

Unfortunately, no.
I believe there are ways to check your blood sugar (for diabetes patients)

What do they check exactly if they cannot see the insulin spike?


-One hour and half between each snacks is 99% sure on the insulin response? (with eating only 1 fruit)
Talking about that, how long last the insulin's spike after eating one fruit, let's say 1 banana?
And how long approximately does it take to fructose to enter blood and to kick in? Same question with complex carbs.

-I am not sure if it's here I read that but on the site I think I saw something like fibers were not good or something like that? If so, could you give a link because I can't find it. If not, nevermind.

Thanx again for your answers.

[Iris]

Is there tests for check your insulin response? This would be the perfect answer for to know how much fruits/fish one can eat at once?

It would not give you any answers other than what was the response to that specific meal given those specific circumstances, which constantly change.

But my snacks do not change usually. That's why I want to check. Especially my breakfast, which contains munchfood (white bread, chocolate etc...)

Still, you're energy needs change constantly. One day you may need more or less then the last and the next, and the day after that, and so on. So it's impossible to tell. The only one who CAN tell is you I think, by listening carefully to what your body tells you. So if you'd stop eating emediately when you feel your direct energy requirements are satisfied, you will never get a big insulin response. But if you'd eat while your body doesn't need the energy you will trigger an insulin response. So there's much more to it then what you eat. It's also important how muh energy you need at that moment.
But overall, the insulin response to bread is much higher then say an apple, of course. But then again, this also depends on how much you eat of both.

-I am not sure if it's here I read that but on the site I think I saw something like fibers were not good or something like that? If so, could you give a link because I can't find it. If not, nevermind.

Indeed, fibers seem to have no purpose at all, and cause tine wounds in the bowels. Here is a link that says something about it, but I think there is more info in the Free Acne book. http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/constipation.htm

[Rivera]

Still, you're energy needs change constantly. One day you may need more or less then the last and the next, and the day after that, and so on. So it's impossible to tell. The only one who CAN tell is you I think, by listening carefully to what your body tells you. So if you'd stop eating emediately when you feel your direct energy requirements are satisfied, you will never get a big insulin response. But if you'd eat while your body doesn't need the energy you will trigger an insulin response. So there's much more to it then what you eat. It's also important how muh energy you need at that moment.

So someone who needs a lot of energy, let's say bodybuilders, can eat like 4 or 5 fruits at once without triggering a big insulin response?
I don't understand the relation between insulin response and needs. You may have big needs, you still have to get sugar in small portions, no?
Insulin doesn't care about needs, it just need to clear the blood of the excess of sugar.

And if we can't know about insulin response exactly, how can we be sure that eating so much fruits per day (even in small portions) won't affect insulin over the years? I mean, for example, we are not sure about how long last the insulin spike. So all is just a theory?

Indeed, fibers seem to have no purpose at all, and cause tine wounds in the bowels. Here is a link that says something about it, but I think there is more info in the Free Acne book. http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/constipation.htm

But fibers do slow down entry of sugar into blood, right? For example, between white bread and whole bread, whole bread is better because it has fibers.

-How long before going to bed, should we stop eating?

-Fishes like salmon provides fat, do oysters has fat too?

Thanks

[Iris]

So someone who needs a lot of energy, let's say bodybuilders, can eat like 4 or 5 fruits at once without triggering a big insulin response?

That depends on a lot of things. 4 or 5 pieces of fruit seems a bit much to me, but if his blood suger is low and his glycogen depots are completely empty he could eat some fruits. First his blood sugar level will rise, and when it is high, insulin will help store the extra energy in glycogen depots. When those are full too, excess energy will be stored as body fat (through insulin). When exactly the body starts secreting much insulin is impossible to say for someone else. It's not that you can eat an x amount of fruit and you'll be "save". But if you don't eat more than you need, then you won't get a big insulin response. So eating small portions is the best way to make sure you don't ingest to much energy and hence secrete much insulin. Also, over time you will learn to recognize your body's signs, so you will be better able to tell whether you are in need of energy or not. If you are not sure you need energy, just ask yourself if you have the energy to lift and replace some heavy stuff for example, or to go ride your bike for a while (you don't have to do it, just test your "hunger"). If the answer is no, you probably need some energy. I sometimes test my energy needs by asking myself whether I feel like I could take my dog out for a walk (I always walk 2 - 2,5 hours at once with him) If not I eat/drink something. It's hard to explain, but if your energy level is running low, I think your body will deffinitively tell you.

I don't understand the relation between insulin response and needs. You may have big needs, you still have to get sugar in small portions, no?

When you eat small portions of fruit regularly, you will never have big energy needs. But when your blood suger level is (very) low (for example in the morning when you wake up) you could eat more then when it is just dropping a bit. Then a small zip of juice may be enough.

it [insulin] just need to clear the blood of the excess of sugar.

exactly, so the amount of insulin secreted depends on how much sugar is in your blood. And the bigger the meal, the more energy, the more insulin is secreted. But if there is no excess energy, there will be no need to secrete much insulin.

And if we can't know about insulin response exactly, how can we be sure that eating so much fruits per day (even in small portions) won't affect insulin over the years? I mean, for example, we are not sure about how long last the insulin spike. So all is just a theory?

No, it's logic
Over all, a fruits diet cause less insulin secretion then a cooked food diet I think (even if you'd eat 3 big fruit meals a day, it would still be better then 3 "normal" meals of cooked foods). Also, as said earlier, protein triggers a greater insulin response then carbs.

But on this forum (and the old one) is a lot of information available regarding insulin, so maybe everything will get more clear to you when you'd read more about it. For example here viewtopic.php?t=1118&highlight=insulin and here http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/diabetes.htm

But fibers do slow down entry of sugar into blood, right?

Yes, but so does fat.

For example, between white bread and whole bread, whole bread is better because it has fibers.

Hmm, I wouldn't say that. As I said earlier, fibers inflict tiny wounds in your bowels, so I don't see how it could be good to you. Maybe it would be better just to eat a lot of fat with your bread??? But I don't know which one is "better". I think they're both detrimental to your health. It's a choise between 2 evils

-How long before going to bed, should we stop eating?

Uuh, I always drink my last zip of juice right before going to bed....

-Fishes like salmon provides fat, do oysters has fat too?

Yes, but only a little bit. 100 gram of oysters contains only 1,20 g of fat. In Salmon there's 13,6 g of fat/100 g.

[RRM]

What do they check exactly if they cannot see the insulin spike?

The blood sugar level; keeping it right is a lifesaver.

-One hour and half between each snacks is 99% sure on the insulin response? (with eating only 1 fruit)

No, because that may very well be too little, which is also not good.

Talking about that, how long last the insulin's spike after eating one fruit

It fades away.

And how long approximately does it take to fructose to enter blood and to kick in?

That depends on how fast it is taken up from the stomach, which depends on what is in the stomach (all stomach contents)

Same question with complex carbs.

It differs for different complex carbs.
It differs for the food the carbs are contained in
It differs on how that food is prepared
etc

So someone who needs a lot of energy, let's say bodybuilders, can eat like 4 or 5 fruits at once without triggering a big insulin response?

The bigger the meals, the more insulin is secreted.
Sure they can do so, but small meals are best.

Insulin doesn't care about needs,

Of course it does: when the blood sugar level was low before the meal, less insulin will be excreted due to the meal, simply because it takes more glucose to get to the point of evoking the secretion of insulin.

it just need to clear the blood of the excess of sugar.

Insulin also responds (equally or more) strongly to amino acids (protein).

how can we be sure that eating so much fruits per day (even in small portions) won't affect insulin over the years?

Because on this diet you learn to listen to your body.

So all is just a theory?

Its every day's reality.

-How long before going to bed, should we stop eating?

That depends on your blood sugar level.
Learn to listen to your body.

[johndela1]

I think I am listening to by body, but this seems like something that is not obvious to me. My weight has been constant for years, but how can I differentiate between my energy level and my emotional feeling of energy?

I've experienced times where I was tired and felt like I had low energy levels, but after seeing something that really got my interested I was full of energy (with not food). This is what mean by emotional feelings of energy.

[Rivera]

-One hour and half between each snacks is 99% sure on the insulin response? (with eating only 1 fruit)

No, because that may very well be too little, which is also not good.

But it's still better than having insulin level high, right? It may be not good if my body has needs but in this case sugar will be release from some place. I don't mean to starve myself but just trying to be careful as we cannot know for sure about insulin response. I don't want to get diabete later.

Talking about that, how long last the insulin's spike after eating one fruit

It fades away.

Ok, but it fades away in about 10 minutes or it takes 40 minutes?

And how long approximately does it take to fructose to enter blood and to kick in?

That depends on how fast it is taken up from the stomach, which depends on what is in the stomach (all stomach contents)

Making me think that it is recommended to eat the egg yolk or fish right after the fruit, but in the stomach, everything is upside down? Is order really important when eating something right after another? Does it really make a difference? Especially with so small portions? Stomach will start to digest both at the same time.
It's like putting 1 shirt and 1 jean in the machine, they will be upside down right after. You know what I mean?

So all is just a theory?

Its every day's reality.

But do we have old and long data experiences about Wai diet? Even if it sounds great we still have to be cautious, right?

-How long before going to bed, should we stop eating?

That depends on your blood sugar level.

But I cannot know this. Listening my body wont tell me surely neither.
If energy levels are normal, it is better to stop eating 1 hour or 2 before getting to bed? Or sugar may be stored as fat.

Learn to listen to your body.

I think I am listening to by body, but this seems like something that is not obvious to me. My weight has been constant for years, but how can I differentiate between my energy level and my emotional feeling of energy?

I join to what Johndela1 said, because me too, --I think you're right by saying to listening your body--, but ask someone who doesn't know nothing about nutrition and show him a table full of fruits, vegetables, raw fish, eggs etc... Even if he listens his body, I'm pretty sure he won't eat correctly regarding his insulin.
In the nature when we find fruits, it's never only one at the time. You find the tree full of it or catch a big fish and you eat until you finish. So you have to eat something bigger than just one fruit.

-There are combinaitons for fruits, but you constantly say one fruit at the time is the best so why talking about combination in this case?
So we must not eat fish/egg yolk with fruit too? Because proteins trigger insulin.

-How monkeys get their fats intake?

[Oscar]

The easiest way (to learn) is to use small amounts (1 (piece of) fruit, 1 sip of juice) and eat/drink when you feel your energy go down (a bit).

In nature animals also don't eat until they've finished everything, they eat until they've had enough.

[johndela1]

The easiest way (to learn) is to use small amounts (1 (piece of) fruit, 1 sip of juice) and eat/drink when you feel your energy go down (a bit).

In nature animals also don't eat until they've finished everything, they eat until they've had enough.

Are you referring to non carnivorous?

With some animals (wolves, carnivorous birds) they simply eat as much as they can to the point where they can not really do much until some time passes for digestion.

[Oscar]

The same goes for us really.

[johndela1]

But that doesn't mean it goes for animals in general. Some animals eat till they have had enough others eat till they can't eat anymore. Some vultures eat so much they can't fly for a while, wolves will eat so much they can barely walk.

I don't think we should look at animals in the general sense to learn how we should eat.

[RRM]

True, but then again, maybe we can learn something from almost any animal. And of course we should analyze the circumstances of the animal of issue.

[johndela1]

My point is that we can't just look at animals to see how to eat there are too many different types of animals. Bonobos are very similar to us, but like you said there are they face different circumstances than we do. Some animals are grazers some animals eat large meals infrequently. Some animals have extremely fast metabolisms and some have extremely slow metabolisms.

There are some advantages to maintaining our blood sugar by grazing and there are some advantages to eating infrequently.

[johndela1]

The easiest way (to learn) is to use small amounts (1 (piece of) fruit, 1 sip of juice) and eat/drink when you feel your energy go down (a bit).

How much should a sip be? Like 1 OZ or less? I'd like to take a day to try this. I'll sip OJ and have some fish for lunch and yolks at bed time. If I use OJ as my only source of energy (apart from the fish and yolks), I should have an easier time learning how to feel my energy.