I have read that eat less frequently has benefits.
Check this out: http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20030607/food.asp
Do yo think the Wai diet contradicts these findings?
prevention of additional fat
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johndela1
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This is what their reasoning is about:
"they've observed that calorie-restricted animals have improved insulin sensitivity. In people, this change protects against diabetes.
Mattson and his colleagues observed better insulin sensitivity in the mice fed every other day than in those that ate daily."
Calorie restriction 'warns' the body of occuring 'food shortages'. Therefore, the body will be more alert to store consumed nutrients, hence the increased insulin sensitivity.
Simply stating that increased insulin sensitivity is better because it is the opposite of that what happens in diabates (decreased insulin sensitivity), is oversimplifying. In the body its not about black or white but about balance.
Decreased insulin sensitivity may be caused by OVER-burdening the insulin system, but may also be caused by 'UNDER'-burdening of the insulin system, as the latter makes it less required 'to be alert'; as if the insulin system is in a 'sleep mode'.
So, decreased insulin sensitivity may be bad, but it may also be good, depending on what has happened / is happening.
"they've observed that calorie-restricted animals have improved insulin sensitivity. In people, this change protects against diabetes.
Mattson and his colleagues observed better insulin sensitivity in the mice fed every other day than in those that ate daily."
Calorie restriction 'warns' the body of occuring 'food shortages'. Therefore, the body will be more alert to store consumed nutrients, hence the increased insulin sensitivity.
Simply stating that increased insulin sensitivity is better because it is the opposite of that what happens in diabates (decreased insulin sensitivity), is oversimplifying. In the body its not about black or white but about balance.
Decreased insulin sensitivity may be caused by OVER-burdening the insulin system, but may also be caused by 'UNDER'-burdening of the insulin system, as the latter makes it less required 'to be alert'; as if the insulin system is in a 'sleep mode'.
So, decreased insulin sensitivity may be bad, but it may also be good, depending on what has happened / is happening.
I've never considered this. It sounds possible, but who knows.RRM wrote:This is what their reasoning is about:
Decreased insulin sensitivity may be caused by OVER-burdening the insulin system, but may also be caused by 'UNDER'-burdening of the insulin system, as the latter makes it less required 'to be alert'; as if the insulin system is in a 'sleep mode'.
So, decreased insulin sensitivity may be bad, but it may also be good, depending on what has happened / is happening.
I have some more points about eating often... I'll paste in the list, but I edited out the first 3 because they where social issues not health based...
If this is too much for you to respond too at once, I'll understand if you don't respond or delete this post.
4. While it is important to avoid insulin spikes (they are by far the most damaging) it is not so good to have a continuous infusion of insulin in your system. They can produce atherosclerosis in lab animals by infusing insulin continuously. Not a good thing for your blood vessels I suspect.
5. Your basal insulin level will rise as a consequence of maintaining a constant level in your blood stream This is not good at all.
6. You constantly have food in your stomach. How can you do anything demanding in this condition? You can't. And your stomach suffers from not having a break from continuous work; the mucosal lining breaks down and this is sometimes called diabetic stomach since some diabetics have to eat often to maintain their blood glucose levels.
7. You never experience hunger, a powerful trigger of gene expression that turns on DNA repair and heat shock proteins. So, your maintenance program is seldom activated.
8. You will, in general, have more fat mass than if you ate every other day and maintained the same body weight.
9. There isn't any evidence that this form of eating promotes health or the growth of lean muscle mass.
10. You weaken the growth hormone response you get from exercise and when you fall into REM sleep.
If this is too much for you to respond too at once, I'll understand if you don't respond or delete this post.
4. While it is important to avoid insulin spikes (they are by far the most damaging) it is not so good to have a continuous infusion of insulin in your system. They can produce atherosclerosis in lab animals by infusing insulin continuously. Not a good thing for your blood vessels I suspect.
5. Your basal insulin level will rise as a consequence of maintaining a constant level in your blood stream This is not good at all.
6. You constantly have food in your stomach. How can you do anything demanding in this condition? You can't. And your stomach suffers from not having a break from continuous work; the mucosal lining breaks down and this is sometimes called diabetic stomach since some diabetics have to eat often to maintain their blood glucose levels.
7. You never experience hunger, a powerful trigger of gene expression that turns on DNA repair and heat shock proteins. So, your maintenance program is seldom activated.
8. You will, in general, have more fat mass than if you ate every other day and maintained the same body weight.
9. There isn't any evidence that this form of eating promotes health or the growth of lean muscle mass.
10. You weaken the growth hormone response you get from exercise and when you fall into REM sleep.
Halftime of insulin in the blood is about 30 mins, as far as I know.johndela1 wrote:What do you think about this. I just read an article that said don't eat too often because your insulin levels never drop as low as they should.
If you are eating sugary foods every 2 hours (or juice) isn't there always insulin in your system?
It depends whether you trigger insulin when you eat or not. Insulin secretion is primarily regulated by the blood sugar and protein levels. If that level rises above the saturation level, insulin will be secreted to induce glucose-to-glycogen conversion (or glucose-to-glycerol for that matter). The higher the spike, the more insulin is secreted.
See above.johndela1 wrote:4. While it is important to avoid insulin spikes (they are by far the most damaging) it is not so good to have a continuous infusion of insulin in your system. They can produce atherosclerosis in lab animals by infusing insulin continuously. Not a good thing for your blood vessels I suspect.
5. Your basal insulin level will rise as a consequence of maintaining a constant level in your blood stream This is not good at all.
We eat foods which are easily digestible. The stomach mainly breaks the food into smaller pieces (hydrochloric acid), and only 'actively' digests protein (pepsin). I guess one could compare it to doing an 8-hour workload in those 8 hours or in 3. What would stress more?johndela1 wrote:6. You constantly have food in your stomach. How can you do anything demanding in this condition? You can't. And your stomach suffers from not having a break from continuous work; the mucosal lining breaks down and this is sometimes called diabetic stomach since some diabetics have to eat often to maintain their blood glucose levels.
?johndela1 wrote:7. You never experience hunger, a powerful trigger of gene expression that turns on DNA repair and heat shock proteins. So, your maintenance program is seldom activated.
Wrong.johndela1 wrote:8. You will, in general, have more fat mass than if you ate every other day and maintained the same body weight.
?johndela1 wrote:9. There isn't any evidence that this form of eating promotes health or the growth of lean muscle mass.
?johndela1 wrote:10. You weaken the growth hormone response you get from exercise and when you fall into REM sleep.
If you eat normal sized meals, or small meals that are still too big, that is true.johndela1 wrote:I just read an article that said don't eat too often because your insulin levels never drop as low as they should
If you consume meals small enough, it is not, as glucose, fatty acids and amino acids get lost from the blood continously. The meals should only replenish that what has got lost.
Consuming bigger meals, the insulin is required to convert excess glucose into glycogen, for example.
There always is anyway. There is a constant re-balancing between the hormones insulin, glucagon and somatostatin, as their combined and opposing influences fine-tune our blood-energy metabolism.johndela1 wrote:If you are eating sugary foods every 2 hours (or juice) isn't there always insulin in your system?
I guess this is a topic I am very undecided on. I know this doesn't count for much but it seems really strange to have to eat every two hours, being that our bodies our designed to store energy in the liver and muscles for longer than this.
Do you think our bodies where designed our evolved (depending on your belief) to function like this?
I see the rationale behind eating this way, but also think if one eats a good sized meal then has time to digest and have a empty stomach for a while, that it gives the digest system a rest.
I know you can say that it has to working harder in the time it is working than constantly working at a lower level, but I wonder if the digest system is best used this way (with no rest)
Do you think our bodies where designed our evolved (depending on your belief) to function like this?
I see the rationale behind eating this way, but also think if one eats a good sized meal then has time to digest and have a empty stomach for a while, that it gives the digest system a rest.
I know you can say that it has to working harder in the time it is working than constantly working at a lower level, but I wonder if the digest system is best used this way (with no rest)
Actually, its waaaay more often than that!johndela1 wrote:it seems really strange to have to eat every two hours, being that our bodies our designed to store energy in the liver and muscles for longer than this.
I ingest some energy about every 20 minutes.
Our bodies are designed to store the energy from both small and big meals. Naturally, we were fruit eters, constantly eating something. Occasionally we were lucky, and had the opportunity to eat a big meal (when we caught some game, for example). The maximum storage capacity applies to such big meals.
The digestive system does not rest.but also think if one eats a good sized meal then has time to digest and have a empty stomach for a while, that it gives the digest system a rest.
The stomach is just the first stage in the digestive tract. The bowels work 24 hours a day, which requires fat by the way!
With this diet the digestive tract does not have to work as hard, by the way.
Whether you take in small or large meals, the bowels still have to do the same total amount of work, which takes place 24 hours a day.I know you can say that it has to working harder in the time it is working than constantly working at a lower level, but I wonder if the digest system is best used this way (with no rest)
See it as a factory where the basic materials are transported to the door of the factory; it doesn matter whether all is delivered at once, or delivered in smaller quantities, as in both cases the speed of delivery will be higher than the speed of processing them. In both cases the bowels will still be working while you are sleeping.
In fact, the next day, when new basic materials arrive, the factory is still processing materials delivered on previous days. Having all materials delivered at once will not make the factory run any harder.
some of the digest track can rest when you eat say two meals a day
I know not all of it does
When you say we where fruit eaters, that isn't something that is provable or observable so even though I'd like to believe that still have doubts.
What impresses me about this sight is all the references found in the articles. when you say we were originally fruit eaters who do you mean by we? Do you think all humans are basically the same?
I know not all of it does
When you say we where fruit eaters, that isn't something that is provable or observable so even though I'd like to believe that still have doubts.
What impresses me about this sight is all the references found in the articles. when you say we were originally fruit eaters who do you mean by we? Do you think all humans are basically the same?
johndela1,
I have had very bad digestive problems since I was about 14... So almost 8 years.
Since being on this diet (about 4 months) All my problems are gone, I never feel bloaded, i always feel very relaxed (stomach, intestines everything) Not to mention, I am much leaner, have alot more enery and think much more clearly.
I really don't see why you are so afraid of eating more often? If you tried the diet for 2 weeks, or even 1, it can't possible do any harm...especially if you are already starving yourself every other day
So when you say maybe we were made to eat like this do you mean that we are the only species on the planet that is genetically made to get the most out of our plate of spaghetti? I don't understand your reasoning...
If it stems from christian beliefs... I like to think that we (wai diet) are eating what Adam and Eve ate in the garden of eden before they went and screwed it all up... then we got all smart and had to grow evil weat and stinky addictive cheese
I have had very bad digestive problems since I was about 14... So almost 8 years.
Since being on this diet (about 4 months) All my problems are gone, I never feel bloaded, i always feel very relaxed (stomach, intestines everything) Not to mention, I am much leaner, have alot more enery and think much more clearly.
I really don't see why you are so afraid of eating more often? If you tried the diet for 2 weeks, or even 1, it can't possible do any harm...especially if you are already starving yourself every other day
So when you say maybe we were made to eat like this do you mean that we are the only species on the planet that is genetically made to get the most out of our plate of spaghetti? I don't understand your reasoning...
If it stems from christian beliefs... I like to think that we (wai diet) are eating what Adam and Eve ate in the garden of eden before they went and screwed it all up... then we got all smart and had to grow evil weat and stinky addictive cheese
Burden it with less fiber, less antinutrients and less toxins, and you will give ALL of your digestive tract more rest all the time.johndela1 wrote:some of the digest track can rest when you eat say two meals a day
Its is provable.When you say we where fruit eaters, that isn't something that is provable or observable
Through evolution, only species that are fruit-eaters have lost the capacity to produce their own vitamin C.
Biologically and regarding biochemistry? Yes.when you say we were originally fruit eaters who do you mean by we? Do you think all humans are basically the same?
In detail regarding levels of nutrients, hormones etc? No, every individual is different.
I'm not afraid to eat more often, I just don't think it is necessary to have to take in calories every 20 minutes being that the body stores energy in several forms.speuzer wrote:johndela1,
I really don't see why you are so afraid of eating more often? If you tried the diet for 2 weeks, or even 1, it can't possible do any harm...especially if you are already starving yourself every other day
Did I miss something? What does spaghetti eating have to do with this topic? I'm saying I don't think we need to eat every 20 minutes, that is all.speuzer wrote: So when you say maybe we were made to eat like this do you mean that we are the only species on the planet that is genetically made to get the most out of our plate of spaghetti? I don't understand your reasoning...
I must be missing something, this seems like a odd response to my question. I don't think Christians believe that you need to eat less often.speuzer wrote: If it stems from christian beliefs... I like to think that we (wai diet) are eating what Adam and Eve ate in the garden of eden before they went and screwed it all up... then we got all smart and had to grow evil weat and stinky addictive cheese
speuzer wrote:
just don't forget the fish and eggs thing. I've been drwan to the fruitarian 'Garden of Eden' way of eating because on some level, something in me says we should be able to survive on fruits of the land, without killing. Maybe in the begining that is all we ate, until some cluck killed the first animal. Maybe we saw a lion kill, so we did. Who knows, right?
What interests me about our fruit eating ways is, and forgetting all the science and proofs available regarding our omnivorous meat-eating past- is that It is logical that we are fruit eaters and berry pickers. The logic is unmistakable. Fruits are there for the taking. In fact if you don't take them off the tree, the tree let's them go for us to find on the ground.
I'm not going near the 20 minute - two hour eating plan, except to say thay I eat 4-5 meals snacks a day or more, as desired and not by routine. I like the idea of having the freedom to skip now and again and seems to me like humans are designed to accomodate.
I guess to some extent we are eating of the 'Garden'If it stems from christian beliefs... I like to think that we (wai diet) are eating what Adam and Eve ate in the garden of eden before they went and screwed it all up... then we got all smart and had to grow evil weat and stinky addictive cheese
just don't forget the fish and eggs thing. I've been drwan to the fruitarian 'Garden of Eden' way of eating because on some level, something in me says we should be able to survive on fruits of the land, without killing. Maybe in the begining that is all we ate, until some cluck killed the first animal. Maybe we saw a lion kill, so we did. Who knows, right? What interests me about our fruit eating ways is, and forgetting all the science and proofs available regarding our omnivorous meat-eating past- is that It is logical that we are fruit eaters and berry pickers. The logic is unmistakable. Fruits are there for the taking. In fact if you don't take them off the tree, the tree let's them go for us to find on the ground.
I'm not going near the 20 minute - two hour eating plan, except to say thay I eat 4-5 meals snacks a day or more, as desired and not by routine. I like the idea of having the freedom to skip now and again and seems to me like humans are designed to accomodate.